La Force + Temperance = The Sphinx

La Force + Temperance = The Sphinx

Messagepar Paul » Dim Fév 08, 2009 4:26 am

Hello all.

Within a recent reading of mine, XI-La Force and XIIII Temperance formed a perfect couple, within the row of solutions. I found these two juxtaposed together to be intriguing, to the point that I had to investigate their association!!! I kept thinking “Sphinx”.


:Tar11U: :Tar14U: = Image

I suspected that Leo and Virgo equal the Sphinx. So, I consulted the Google Oracle. I made great sacrifices, offering up a wonderful lasagna I just made, grain, and a goat. :shock: The Great Google revealed to me that others had, in fact, proposed this association! :oops:

Oh well. I thought I might be brilliant... :roll:

But, in a Tarot reading using the Camoin Method, I would surmise that these two cards gazing at each other might form a salient couple, because within the constellations, Virgo and Leo are near each other, thus they form the Sphinx by juxtaposition or cusp. But, what does it mean? Certainly, there are esoteric layers of meaning here. But, in a reading of the Tarot, the meanings can become more mundane in an As Above, So Below kind of way. And, of course, in the row of Solutions, the cards take on a "verb" quality.

This combination seems to marry strength/power with discretion/duty.
The lion can represent the fierce summer; Virgo, the taming Autumn.
Astronomically, this was also the time of the rising of the Nile.
The lion brings the Sun, the Virgin brings the water.

It would seem that this is a winning combination!

Thoughts?
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Re: La Force + Temperance = The Sphinx

Messagepar Phine » Dim Fév 08, 2009 9:10 am

Good morning, Paul :D



well, my first thought looking at this combination on a more mundane level was:

Healing of two opposing aspects of the inner self in a balanced way...
When I looked at the cards, Lady Force and the lion become the jars in Temperance, which are now connected by an energy (maybe water, what´s pretty interesting as both cards refer to the element of fire... GD-likely spoken). These two forces of a person - human and animal - shown in XIII La Force get the same "quality" in XIIII Tempérance (same size, same shape, same colours - there are just little differences in their designs :roll: ), they are of equal value - and they are united or blessed or simply held by an angel, a power from heaven => "energy of the universe" => overall love ??
- Writing this I wonder where it comes from and suddenly see XIIII Art from the Thoth in my mind´s eye... The wedding of VI The Lovers, which in XIIII Art succeeds...

So IMO this combination shows a sort of inner healing, a process of learning to accept ones facets, to integrate them to live ones wholeness (?). Gosh, it´s pretty difficult to describe all this in english... :? But I hope you´ll get the message...



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Re: La Force + Temperance = The Sphinx

Messagepar Paul » Lun Fév 09, 2009 2:25 am

Phine a écrit:Gosh, it´s pretty difficult to describe all this in english... :? But I hope you´ll get the message...


I think your English is great. :D

Hello Phine, my fellow mad scientist. Together, we are creating monstrous ideas!

Image

Or, we are making fools of ourselves to those in the know of the Camoin secrets. :oops: (And anyone else in the know or not in the know would be welcome in our quiet english café.)

I like your idea of the transmogrification of the lion. :) It helps to see what the characters are doing and how they are changing, as if looking at a comic book strip; or, as if flipping the pages of one of those cartoon books we had as kids, wherein we flip the pages to see the characters move.

Anyhoo. I found that Jodorowsky did not address this particular combination (unless I am missing something in his book). Of course, the context of the question is paramount in any interpretation of a symbol-- much the same as in dream interpretation, the dreamer and the dreamer's life are paramount.

Some Tarot scholars have noted that La Force seems to express Virgo suppressing Leo, :Tar11U: much the same as the constellations display, with Virgo and Leo in proximity.
Then, we have Virgo proper (XIIII) with Hydra at her feet. :Tar14U:
And, we have Virgo holding the scales of Libra in VIII. :Tar08U:
So, this person gets a lot of airtime! Here's a snippet from the Southern Constellation Map. Note Virgo, the Cup, Hydra. Note Leo. Note Libra.

Image

Here's what Manilius said about the influence of the constellation Virgo:

"The temperaments of those whose span of life she pronounces at their birth [Virgo] will direct to study, and she will train their minds in the learned arts. She will give not so much abundance of wealth as the impulse to investigate the causes and effects of things. On them she will confer a tongue which charms, the mastery of words, and that mental vision which can discern all things, however concealed they be by the mysterious workings of nature. From the Virgin will also come the stenographer: his letter represents a word, and by means of his symbols he can keep ahead of utterance and record in novel notation the long speech of a rapid speaker. But with the good there comes a flaw: bashfulness handicaps the early years of such persons, for the Maid, by holding back their great natural gifts, puts a bridle on their lips and restrains them by the curb of authority. And (small wonder in a virgin) her offspring is not fruitful. [Astronomica, Manilius, 1st century AD, p.237 and 239]"

...and of Leo:

"Who can doubt the nature of the monstrous Lion, and the pursuits he prescribes for those born beneath his sign? The lion ever devises fresh fights and fresh warfare on animals, and lives on spoil and pillaging of flocks. The sons of the Lion are filled with the urge to adorn their proud portals with pelts and to hang up on their walls the captured prey, to bring the peace of terror to the woods, and to live upon plunder. There are those whose like bent is not checked by the city-gates, but they swagger about in the heart of the capital with droves of beasts ; they display mangled limbs at the shop-front, slaughter to meet the demands of luxury, and count it gain to kill. Their temper is equally prone to fitful wrath and ready withdrawal, and guileless are the sentiments of their honest hearts" [Manilius, Astronomica, 1st century AD, p.237.]"

So, using only an astrological/constellation layer of interpretation, as "advice" this combination could be signifying speaking with care and self-control; tempering boldness with eloquence. They definitely juxtapose two different energies.

But, I do not mean to suggest that there is a readymade lexicon of card-combinations for every Tarot question under the Sun.

This was like the Sphinx of Oedipus, who could craft and articulate a Riddle, and then attack with ruthlessness any poor soul who could not answer it.
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Re: La Force + Temperance = The Sphinx

Messagepar skip » Sam Fév 14, 2009 1:03 pm

I may be stating the obvious, but a sphinx that resembles your painting of Oedipus can be found on X, La Roue de Fortune. So if you are looking for one with wings, I would say no need to look further....

As for Temperance, I don't recall Virgo having ever been known as a water bearer. That function belongs to the sign Aquarius, n'est-ce pas?

But I like how your mind works! Personally the image that comes up for me with these two cards is a veterinarian and her nurse/assistant.... :?

If my vocation were about looking inside lions' mouths, I would certainly want someone standing by with a sedative!! :lol:


or considering your mad scientist pic, dare I say a..... sed-a-give? :wink: :lol:

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Re: La Force + Temperance = The Sphinx

Messagepar Paul » Sam Fév 14, 2009 3:41 pm

skip a écrit:As for Temperance, I don't recall Virgo having ever been known as a water bearer. That function belongs to the sign Aquarius, n'est-ce pas?
skip


Hi Skip:

Ahhh. Salient point, indeed.
Notwithstanding, I would offer that she's not pouring out her liquids onto the earth, à la Aquarius. That job belongs to XVII-Le Toille.
Image :Tar17U:

Temperance is blending, or really diluting wine, as in classical art, which is an age-old motif of the Virtue of temperance, in general.
Well, that's my case for it anyway. :wink:
Image

Virgo is part of the Virgo Super Cluster, which includes Virgo of course, Hydra the snake, and Crater the cup, all evident on Temperance.
Image

Of course, I don't think there's a perfect match on any of these cards.
The Tarot is syncretic, and it blends multiple astro/cultural/anthropological /religious/art systems.
So, this could be a case of syncretism, i.e. the blending of classical art images of Temperance with Crater the Cup, with Virgo...otherwise, we might as well cut up an ancient constellation map into squares and paste them on cards, and call it a day. :P

But, the very point you mention (and other asynchronous elements in general with the Tarot=Constellation Map thesis) has made a precise card-for-card match for me sometimes a conundrum.

I just realized this could be a separate thread. :o
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Re: La Force + Temperance = The Sphinx

Messagepar Paul » Sam Fév 14, 2009 4:43 pm

skip a écrit:considering your mad scientist pic, dare I say a..... sed-a-give? :wink: :lol:

skip


...Or, at the very least, he needs some hair conditioner.
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Re: La Force + Temperance = The Sphinx

Messagepar skip » Lun Fév 16, 2009 4:33 am

I always thought of the water bearer as male, Ganymede at the side of Zeus; your interpretation is opening me to different possibilities. Thanks!

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